KEN WILBER's 2016 Interview by RAQUEL TORRENT - ADENDUM to question nr. 4 about Trump & Clinton

ADENDUM TO QUESTION NR. 4 

Organized, transcribe & translated to Spanish

by RAQUEL TORRENT

As I wanted to share rapidly Ken's opinion about Trump & Clinton's political candidacy, on the day of the Elections, I posted the first part of question nr. 4 of the Interview so that you would have an advancement of his ideas.  Here you have the rest of the question. 

Ken Wilber - Denver

Right now we have this fundamentally fragmented viewpoints under this dominant cultural sense or relativity,  where nothing is better than anything else.  Everything is equally special,  equally important and where you cannot say this is good and that's bad as all that is Taboo. That just paralyzes action.  I call it "Aperspectival Madness", which it means no perspective is better than another, no perspective has any more value than another. And yet that view itself is the product of six stages of hierarchical growth¡  If you actually go their way, you could see they destroy their stands. They will never get up to their stands.  So it's a mess¡  And again is part of what I see unfortunately as a couple of decades of fairly unpleasant world situation.

Now, I know a fair number of people that are looking at the leading edge, seeing a slow but distinctively  visible growth. They have Integral, Holistic worldviews.  Even if they don't understand all of the stages of development and realize that those integral worldviews are coming from one of the very high stages of development (and only about 5% of the world's population is at that stage), these stages are there and this 5% of people who have those kinds of views too.  Part of the problem is that they do not have the authority to change anything yet. But the important thing is that they may realize that the viewpoint that they're talking about is real and there are people that increasingly have that same viewpoint. And it's not that we're making it if you think about it. 

Some people think that we have the old and the new paradigms.  The old paradigm is all of that other stuff combined like if half of the world is at the new paradigm and the other half is at the old and then we slip over to the new paradigm and that will save everything. It would be very nice that 50% of the world would be there, but it's not ¡  So it's true they're not in decisions of power.  What happens is that in some cases people at higher levels of development tend to do better in most disciplines,  in most professions than other stages. Because of that,  some high percentage of high accomplishment individuals are at that 5%.  If you take really influential forces in any discipline, more likely like a 20% of them are at Integral stages because they're concentrated in those upper accomplishment levels.  They don't see how they got there, they don't see that it's just part of an overall spectrum of many different stages of growth and development. And that's part of the problem¡  It also gives them a hard time understanding why the world is in such a mess when they have this wonderfully developed high world view. 

They just say, well we're in the edge of a great mental transformation and it's going to be the biggest change in all of Human's History and everything is going to be perfect and amazing. Then you say,  okay, if it's already around the world , then show me.   And then they go like:   Hmmm, ha,, Hmmm. no, well, that's a  disaster.  It's a real disaster.  That doesn't work¡   So they're really confused and they can't explain it. The reason being  that they have a very growing kit of development, a relatively small percentage of relationships are at those levels,  they don't have much influence right now and particularly that people at Integral levels worldwide haven't learnt to Self Identify.  If they are at an Integral level, most of them don't know that they are at an Integral level. They don't realize that that's where they're coming from and so all they know is that a lot of people around them can't see what they're seeing.  So they tend to feel fairly lonely. If you tell somebody "Oh you believe in traditional values, or you believe in family values, or you believe in fundamentalists religious values",  they certainly know what you mean by that.  If you say: "Oh you have very Modern set of values", they sure would have a sense about what that is.  And then you say "Oh you're very multicultural, you know about diversity, you've very Postmodern values", they go:  "yeah that's right". They all self identify. They all know that they represent a particular values set. Many Integral people don't know that. They don't know that they represent a very specific and identifiable group of individuals at a very specific stage of development.  And it is so because there is not a significant number of them yet¡  Only the people that know my work have the knowledge about levels of development, about what they represent and about where they're at.

Historically something interesting happens when the very leading edge reaches 10% of the population  (which at this moment would be Teal, that is about 4 to 5% of the population and less than 1% at Turquoise and the largest number of people at green:  20 or 25%).  For example,  when orange  reached 10% of the population there seemed to be a tipping point and orange values got from sort of being very unheard off to kind of saturating all Culture.  So when 10% of the population hit orange in Europe, we had the Western Enlightenment, the French and American Revolutions, slavery was outlawed for the first time in all of Human History. Only 10% of the population directly held those values and yet the whole Culture sort of went along with it.  The same thing happened when 10% of the population hit green. Then we had the Civil Rights movement, the Environmental movement, the Feminists movements, Multiculturalism and so on. So, we see that  even though only 10% of the population actually has those values, the whole Culture becomes open to them and sort of sips down and permeates mentalities.  When the leading edge now, 10% of the population reaches Teal, then we can expect the whole Culture to kind of  open to Integral values. Then we can start seeing genuine cultural movements demanding integral approaches to almost everything; just like we saw with orange and green:  Political movements, Revolutions bringing Democracy, replacing Monarchy and Aristocracy,  Civil Rights movements, Multiculturalism.  We're going to see Integral Holistic All Inclusive movements coming in and demanding changes. And this will take something like from 10 to 40 or 50 years. The reason is hard to say is for one thing the interval between stages in terms of overall Evolution.  It gets progressively shorter and shorter and shorter.  The first stage took like 200.000 years for the next stage to emerge and the next stage took like 20.000 years and the next about 4000 years and the next stage about 1000 years and the next like 300 years and the next stage in 30 years, The only problem is that because this is a shift in Tiers, we don't know how the unfolding time actually works when starting this change in Tier.  It might go back to longer periods at the lower levels of that Tier and then become shorter. We just don't know¡ If it just keeps going at the same rate, then we would expect Second Tier to take less than 30 years to come into existence. So far it hasn't happened ¡ So far green has been the major dominant edge for just about 40 years and Second Tier is only at 4% .